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Community => Discussion => Topic started by: Rotacak on February 21, 2013, 05:57:50 PM

Title: New name for our game?
Post by: Rotacak on February 21, 2013, 05:57:50 PM
DECIDED: We will have new name.

After discussion here (http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16997.msg235690#msg235690) I want to ask you - truly Tremulous fans.

What is your opinion for name change?

I wanted to make Tremulous to live much longer. But now I starting to hate this name (after many years, it is funny). I am not sure if I still want it. Currently I would like to cut everything from this name, let it die and continue with new name without history.

What is your opinion?
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: MegaMedic on February 21, 2013, 06:20:32 PM
Well, you started with the name and now if you want to change it, you need to change everything. Stay with Tremulous 2. Don't listen haters.
Also, if old developers have copyright for this title, they will never make Tremulous 2. You can change everything and don't let's this die. Don't give up! Keep continue.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Rotacak on February 21, 2013, 06:40:43 PM
MegaMedic: its just about the name. They do not have trademark and anything, but do we still want to support this name? It is not because of complainers, they will be there allways (if we will change name, they will hate price, closed source, graphic, sounds, just everything).

It's about that we/me had some idol that we want to support with longer life, but idol said "fuck you".

It would not affect the gameplay in any way of course.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Lancer on February 21, 2013, 07:23:23 PM
MegaMedic: its just about the name. They do not have trademark and anything, but do we still want to support this name? It is not because of complainers, they will be there allways (if we will change name, they will hate price, closed source, graphic, sounds, just everything).

It's about that we/me had some idol that we want to support with longer life, but idol said "fuck you".

It would not affect the gameplay in any way of course.

Well, give us a few suggestions, what's on your mind rotacak?
For now - Give the project the codename Tremulous 2 :)
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: grmg.pl on February 21, 2013, 07:27:55 PM
1. From the standpoint of law, do you HAVE to change the name? What's the worst thing that can happen from the LAW standpoint?

Quote from: Timbo, 1.1/1.2 dev
Since "Tremulous 2" is a commercial project, you are presumably not wanting to adhere to said licensing terms and must contact all copyright owners to gain their permission. (...)You contacted me in November and I declined


2. From the "being fair" standpoint - sure, the game idea is "owned" by original 1.1/1.2 dev team.

3.
Quote from: Rota, tremulous.net forum
Name can be trademarked - it is not.
Game content is copyrighted automatically - it is.
Shape of aliens or game technics can be patented - it is not.

We do not breaking trademark (there is no any), copyright (we do not using anything exactly from the game), patent (there is no any)
.

From the "lets get realistic" -  the original 1.1/1.2 devs had YEARS to do something along the lines of T2 as planned by Rota. They didn't and IMO, since even full 1.2 (is gpp, not the full game) is not released, it's not realistic to expect any substantial "new" content (no new ideas implemented, no gfx upgrades etc).

4.
Quote from: Rota on tremulous.net
On the contrary it can make Tremulous 1 unforgotten
Very true. People who will play T2 will be very likely to checkout 1.1/1.2.

5. Stay with the T2 name. Rota releases T2, they release T3.

6. Change the name to something new "Aliens vs humans" (just for example). Do you change the actual content (from tremulous gameplay to for example a space shooter)? Do you have to?

7. Change the name, without changing the content. Add the "spiritual successor to 1.1/1.2" to the tagline. People will but new name game, and still chceckout 1.1/1.2

8. Does the name "Tremulous 2" give Rota any actual/significant boost in sales/popularity from 1.1/1.2 community? System Shock 2 had been "spiritually succesored" ( :P) by Bioshock, but I doubt that System Shock fans had more than tiny part in Bishock sales. Like with the domains: you can have the "keyword" in the domain name, but it's only a part of getting ranked high. It's cool, but it's not that important.

9. Aside from any actual infringements on copy/trade - I's like this:

There is a hot girl you "really like". You've wanted to ask her out for years, but didn't. Some other dude did last week.

Whos' fault is this?

It's very good Rota asked original devs for permission (a gesture of good will, no matter the difference of opinions), but at this point (3 years after 1.2 has been released), cmon' either do something about it or don't make a problem out of the "name".

10. I'm already "hooked" to the gameplay, so the actual name for me is not important. BUT: for the new/incoming fresh potential buyers, if you want to make any moves with the "name/content/gameplay" do it fast, do it decisively. People don't like cloudy issues, they buy what's clear and simple.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Loki on February 21, 2013, 08:12:23 PM
Y NEW NAME!

Grangerophilia
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Axl on February 21, 2013, 08:15:20 PM
I think a good name would be Extermination.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Loki on February 21, 2013, 08:16:33 PM
I think a good name would be Extermination.

no way, too much like excrementation
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Rotacak on February 21, 2013, 08:36:49 PM
grmg.pl:
1)
No. Worst thing that maybe/probably/teoretically can hapen is that they will additionaly register trademark and after that we must to change name. But registering trademark cost money, it is long road (6 months?) and it is not sure that they will obtain it.

On the other hand - we probably cannot register our trademark, so anyone can make Tremulous 3, 4, 5... without problems. And this is bad for us since it is commercial game.

2) Sure.

6) No, this is all about name only. We definitely not change anything in gameplay etc. There is always someone who think that he can dictate us how we must do our game. But we will do this game in our way. And that way is to bring our loved tremulous back, with any name.

We can name it Tremulouz, Trem, Tremendous etc. but that is nonsense - in that case we can leave it as is. If we will change name then to brand new name and we will cut all connection to old game (no thanks to T1 dev, no links to that game etc.).

8) No. There is few hardcore players, whose still play and recognize that T2 have something with T1. But mainly it have absolute no effect. Anyway, we using this sentece "T2 is spiritual successor to T1" so if it will be "ABC is spiritual successor to T1" it will still attract those 10 old players.

Our intention is to create game of course for hard core trem fans (few players), but mainly attract new players. It is impossible without new players.

10) Just the name, don't worry about gameplay.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Nomad on February 21, 2013, 09:59:57 PM
If you were in a situation where you MUST change the name, rename it to Grangelous and make grangers the main mascots.  ;D
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Machine Medic on February 21, 2013, 10:17:22 PM
Personally, I'm opposed to changing the name...

For all it's worth, if it looks like Tremulous, sounds like Tremulous, plays like Tremulous, and is just as fun as Tremulous -if not much, much more-, I'll probably end up calling it Tremulous anyways, along with many of the die-hards.

The original devs are not going to release a sequel to their game, much less put in the effort to do anything other than admire their lack of effort in the last 3 years.  1.2 is dead. 


Tremulous is a name that describes more than just a bunch of aliens trying to kill humans.  Tremulous is an idea, and calling an idea anything other than what it is is quite simply a lie, and an injustice to it at that.

If the original devs are butt-hurt about this project doing what their fat arses are too lazy to do, then they can live with it for all I care.  The idea of Tremulous has had it's patent date expire a long time ago. 


Tremulous is Tremulous, and calling it something less is just a shame.   :-\




I will support a name change the day the original devs trademark Tremulous 1.1, at which point I will have lost all respect I once had for their game.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Nomad on February 21, 2013, 10:44:51 PM
Personally, I'm opposed to changing the name...

For all it's worth, if it looks like Tremulous, sounds like Tremulous, plays like Tremulous, and is just as fun as Tremulous -if not much, much more-, I'll probably end up calling it Tremulous anyways, along with many of the die-hards.

The original devs are not going to release a sequel to their game, much less put in the effort to do anything other than admire their lack of effort in the last 3 years.  1.2 is dead. 


Tremulous is a name that describes more than just a bunch of aliens trying to kill humans.  Tremulous is an idea, and calling an idea anything other than what it is is quite simply a lie, and an injustice to it at that.

If the original devs are butt-hurt about this project doing what their fat arses are too lazy to do, then they can live with it for all I care.  The idea of Tremulous has had it's patent date expire a long time ago. 


Tremulous is Tremulous, and calling it something less is just a shame.   :-\




I will support a name change the day the original devs trademark Tremulous 1.1, at which point I will have lost all respect I once had for their game.


+1
Take all the internets
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: MegaMedic on February 21, 2013, 10:51:19 PM
I agree with Rotacak about players. Not many players from old Tremulous will come here. We depend more for news players.
"Tremulous 2" title is good for a old player who played Tremulous but for a new player I don't know. New player will ask: "Well, what is this 2?" and he will serach for Tremulous 1. I remember when I played first time FEAR 3 and then I serached for FEAR 2 and FEAR 1 lol.

And also, if the game will be in wikipedia, there will say something like "First time this game ough to be called Tremulous 2 and then developers changed name....".

Also, if we think you will need to change everything (Forum name, posters from studio, T-Shirt with Trem 2, Hat with Trem 2, facebook/youtube/twitter name etc)

I don't know what to say guys, we need to think good at this.

EDIT:

I decided. Maybe you should change it. Later when game will be finished that developers can report it for the name (if they are too jelous). Also, they will never make Tremulous 2. They just want to keep up their "copyrights" just to be there.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: (PL) cool boy on February 22, 2013, 05:46:02 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DONT CHANGE THE NAME OR I KILL U ALL!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Rotacak on February 22, 2013, 06:56:32 PM
make grangers the main mascots.  ;D
That is sure thing :)

"Tremulous 2" title is good for a old player who played Tremulous but for a new player I don't know. New player will ask: "Well, what is this 2?" and he will serach for Tremulous 1. I remember when I played first time FEAR 3 and then I serached for FEAR 2 and FEAR 1 lol.
Yea. Today nobody know Infiniminer, but everyone know Minecraft. I would be different if would be Infiniminer 2.

Also, if we think you will need to change everything (Forum name, posters from studio, T-Shirt with Trem 2, Hat with Trem 2, facebook/youtube/twitter name etc)
Actually it is not too much work. It is only new logo, domain and social groups. Nothing what cannot be done in one day.

Trailer - it is more complicated, but meh.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Axl on February 22, 2013, 09:38:06 PM
One thing is for sure if we do change name it will still be Humans VS. Aliens.

If we did change the name,
The name should not be based on aliens it should be based on facts like how the planet is infested with aliens, the name would be like Planet Crisis cause the planet is in crisis cause of the aliens. ;D

The name would go with the game is all I am trying to say.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: (PL) cool boy on February 23, 2013, 09:16:48 AM
OH i have pro name for trem2 GRANGERLANDS!!!!
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Gunther on February 23, 2013, 06:48:36 PM
Name change is not needed. It might even help the old playerbase as was previously mentioned.

Don't think so much. If everyone is thinking too much about this and that, then nothing is getting done and the project will fall flat. It's best to have as little hang-ups as possible, and sitting around thinking of a new name is a backwards step.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: ViruS on February 24, 2013, 08:23:08 AM
Gunther, read this.
To use "tremulous" as the main part of the title requires permission from multiple trem devs, and timbo, the project lead already denies this permission.
http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16997.msg235922#msg235922
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Machine Medic on February 24, 2013, 12:38:28 PM
The name 'Tremulous' is not a registered trademark... AAA can use it however they please.

Copyright only covers content and intellectual property... titles doesn't count as either of the above.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: GoldFish on February 24, 2013, 11:58:08 PM
I like the name...

Zold

and why change the name when AAAGames has made a magazine...poster...and a lot of other stuff :P
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Lancer on February 25, 2013, 01:48:52 PM
I like the name...

Zold

and why change the name when AAAGames has made a magazine...poster...and a lot of other stuff :P

Agreed about the "and why change the name when AAAGames has made a magazine...poster...and a lot of other stuff :P" part.
The art is wonderfull.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Gunther on February 28, 2013, 04:06:15 PM
Gunther, read this.
To use "tremulous" as the main part of the title requires permission from multiple trem devs, and timbo, the project lead already denies this permission.
http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16997.msg235922#msg235922

No, ^those are idiots who say whatever the crap they please.

"Ohhh, it's free for anyone to distribute, modify...but don't you even dare think about using "our" name.
"We let project die and lay forgotten and probably would have forever...until we were reminded by email of course."

For reasons unknown, only Loki and Rotacak seem to bring relevant information to the table, while the other spammers post "bluhhh i will never support dis money-making scam it should be killed and shoved in a hole".

If Timbo wanted any cash from the game then he wouldn't release it for completely and totally free. He sees that a long time community member might have a shot at making a successful game and he wants compensation for it.
Quote from: Timbo
When I mentioned being recompensed and a licensing agreement I was talking hypothetically. My point was simply that if somebody is going to profit from my (and others') work, I expect to receive some of that profit beyond the token gesture that you appeared to be offering in your email.


I won't bother mentioning anything else as I try not to rage online if I can.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Machine Medic on February 28, 2013, 10:30:26 PM
I just lost all respect for Timbo, stooping so low as to try something like that.

Tremulous 1.1 was a fun game developed by a bunch of garage hacks that a few people found incredibly fun. 

If the garage hacks want to get paid for:
 - Forsaking their project for years
 - Releasing their source code
 - Making a visually awful game based on an incredible game idea

Then they can quit their jobs, raise venture capital, and buy UE3 developer seats themselves.

They haven't done half the work, or taken a tenth of the risks Rota is committing to to not only release this game, but also support himself and his team.

The name Tremulous is not a trademark, it is simply the name of an idea - that idea being an ideal game of humans Vs. aliens.  If they truly felt that they were worthy of gaining a profit from everything they have (not) done over the last few years, they would've registered the name of the game as a trademark, and patented the gameplay.

Then again, they don't own any rights to the QA3 engine 1.1 uses, so gaining any profit from it could lead to very big legal trouble on their part.  I'm surprised Timbo didn't think of this when he decided to be a greedy little shit to Rota in his email.


The 1.1 team is pretty much dead to me at this point.  Douchebags don't make good developers, and that's why I support Rota in the T2 project, AND the use of the name Tremulous 2.

Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Gunther on February 28, 2013, 11:58:56 PM
+1

There's no way they're taking our granger plushies.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Machine Medic on March 01, 2013, 12:01:54 AM
They just did.

:L

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/aaagames/tremulous-2-0
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Gunther on March 01, 2013, 12:16:26 AM
They just did.

:L

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/aaagames/tremulous-2-0
I mean seize because they look too much like the 1.1 granger.
But that probably won't happen at all
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Machine Medic on March 01, 2013, 12:21:31 AM
Quote
I mean seize because they look too much like the 1.1 granger.

LOL!

 ;D
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Gunther on March 01, 2013, 02:42:11 PM
And Rotacak gives them the ol' one-two!

http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16997.msg235970#msg235970

As Sheldon Cooper (should have) said:
Quote
Live long, prosper, and suck it Tremulous devs.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: TheTravellingMerchant on March 01, 2013, 04:50:53 PM
And Rotacak gives them the ol' one-two!

http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16997.msg235970#msg235970

As Sheldon Cooper (should have) said:
Quote
Live long, prosper, and suck it Tremulous devs.
Well, hell! Thats quite a problem. An open threat too.. Still, I will miss our beloved granger! (Now there must be an alien thats even CUTER and even more CUDDLY then the granger) Keep it up rota, I think I speak for most of us when I say that we are still looking forward to whatever you create!
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Rotacak on March 01, 2013, 05:05:19 PM
Well, hell! Thats quite a problem. An open threat too.. Still, I will miss our beloved granger! (Now there must be an alien thats even CUTER and even more CUDDLY then the granger) Keep it up rota, I think I speak for most of us when I say that we are still looking forward to whatever you create!
Thank you for your support!
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: EpicalDude on March 01, 2013, 07:20:42 PM
grmg.pl:
1)
No. Worst thing that maybe/probably/teoretically can hapen is that they will additionaly register trademark and after that we must to change name. But registering trademark cost money, it is long road (6 months?) and it is not sure that they will obtain it.

No, completely wrong.
Because the question is wrong.

There is no "law".

There are many various laws in various countries.

USA patents and other intellectual slavery are winning in USA and EU, they can sue you anything even for using bullets in game.
And using anything similar to Tremulous increases problems.
But.
This is stupid.
Until more reasonable laws are passed (maybe when EU communism and USA fascism collapses finally), you should just lawyer up and ignore stupid haters, imo.

And I guess use other name, that one we can do.
Title: Re: New name for our game?
Post by: Campbellz on March 01, 2013, 10:47:42 PM
NEW NAME FOR GAME [POLL]. >> http://forum.tremulous2.com/index.php?topic=120.0